2013 Subaru BRZ

[BlaineWasHere]

Originally Posted by KOA789

I guess the 370Z would be in the same segment, but I really can't think of much else. More options is always better.

No. 370z is in with Mustang. It way larger than BRZ. That's why Nissan is planning a smaller 200 or 250z to go with.

[BlaineWasHere]

Originally Posted by Lucidity

Apples and oranges? Two, two door coupes, front rear setups, both are viewed as performance cars, both can be had for under 27k. How much more similar do they need to be to compare? I guess it was wrong of MT or whoever did the video to compare them as well right? The only things I've really been debating is that this car doesn't live up to the hype. It seems every time the claim is defeated, the goal posts are moved....

They compare it to the Mustang because the BRZ is the ONLY RWD coupe in its size class. MX5 is same size and idea but it's a roadster. Did you miss the fact it's tiny compared to the Mustang?

[KOA789]

Originally Posted by BlaineWasHere

No. 370z is in with Mustang. It way larger than BRZ. That's why Nissan is planning a smaller 200 or 250z to go with.

370Z is 300lbs lighter than the Mustang and is a 2 seater sports car. The Mustang is a 2+2 coupe. I'd say the 370z is more in line with the BRZ than the Mustang.

[BlaineWasHere]

Originally Posted by KOA789

370Z is 300lbs lighter than the Mustang and is a 2 seater sports car. The Mustang is a 2+2 coupe. I'd say the 370z is more in line with the BRZ than the Mustang.

I agree it's closer, but it's still not the same. The BRZ is 700+ lbs lighter than Mustang.

[BlaineWasHere]

I do love the 370, I'm trying to talk my mom into a lightly used one.

[Wild Hare]

No turbo or more HP no buyie!

[utekineir]

Originally Posted by Lucidity

The only things I've really been debating is that this car doesn't live up to the hype.

But that isn't a debate, that has been established since the specs came out.

[BlaineWasHere]

Originally Posted by utekineir

But that isn't a debate, that has been established since the specs came out.

Even I agree it's underpowered, by a lot.

I love everything else about it and will rely on the aftermarket to fix it's flaw.

I like everything else: size, weight, balance, cornering abilities/potential, and styling.

If I do in fact get one I'll spend the first year getting the suspension set-up and handling dialed in. Then unless I really love running it in STX class I'll ad POWER (prob supercharged) and jump into SM class.

The fact of the mater is, is there is a perfect car out there for me, it's call the 911 GT3RS, but I can't afford one. HOWEVER despite it having very little power it seems there IS a car I can buy and drive and have just about as much fun, while doing it slower which is really good for me taking my motorsports driving skill to the next level. That way in 3-5 years I'll be ready for a well balanced car WITH massive power.

[JoeyGTI]

I like everything about it also...except a couple things I noticed from watching some of the videos I posted.....whats up with the 1970's era red flashing LED clock ? and other old looking LED temperature readouts. I mean its 2012... this definitely looks way outdated. Take a look for yourself

[Wild Hare]

Randy Pobst called me the other day and I asked him about this car. He said he was impressed as a drivers car... yet thought it could stand to have more power.
Randy and I used to Autocross together back in the mid '80's in the SCCA.

Randy sent me this link in an email the other day.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPoZ1...ature=youtu.be

Randy comes in at 6:40.

[BlaineWasHere]

I watched that video the other day on YouTube. It really solidified to me I should buy it. I value Randy's opinion, he's a great driver and is on YouTube talking about cars for a reason.

Right, so if a racecar driver is impressed with it as a drivers car, despite it's lack of power then it sounds like a pretty damn good chassis to me.

It is lacking, only about 170RWHP.

[BlaineWasHere]

Especially when he said, "reminds on of one of my favorite cars, the MX-5!"

That's a car with low power that rules Motorsport and is a ton of fun to drive. I hate roadsters so I see the BRZ as a much less gay Miata with a permanent roof.

[Callsign_Jester]

Originally Posted by JoeyGTI

I like everything about it also...except a couple things I noticed from watching some of the videos I posted.....whats up with the 1970's era red flashing LED clock ? and other old looking LED temperature readouts. I mean its 2012... this definitely looks way outdated. Take a look for yourself

I've always been a sucker for simple digital readouts. I rather like it, wish that was the interior on my Wrex. Just throw some gloss black 3M DI-NOC on that large silver piece of trim and BAM, gangsterous.

[Lucidity]

Originally Posted by KOA789

370Z is 300lbs lighter than the Mustang and is a 2 seater sports car. The Mustang is a 2+2 coupe. I'd say the 370z is more in line with the BRZ than the Mustang.

The weight isn't so much a comparison factor as the price. The Stang and BRZ are closer than the 370z is to either.

Originally Posted by BlaineWasHere

They compare it to the Mustang because the BRZ is the ONLY RWD coupe in its size class. MX5 is same size and idea but it's a roadster. Did you miss the fact it's tiny compared to the Mustang?

They compare it because the Mustang while larger is not a Camaro, both can be had around the same price, both are 2+2, coupes, front, rear, etc etc. Both even take design cues from models that came far before them. The rear quarter window desing on the FRS/BRZ was taken from 2000GT (IIRC). To say they aren't similar enough to compare is just horse shit, and only an excuse to reason away why the BRZ doesn't stack up when it comes to real world testing. I get you have convinced yourself this is something you have to get, despite never taking one for a spin, but your ideas of it's epic track ability and it giving the Mustang a run for its money have been thoroughly debunked.

[BlaineWasHere]

Originally Posted by Lucidity

The weight isn't so much a comparison factor as the price. The Stang and BRZ are closer than the 370z is to either.



They compare it because the Mustang while larger is not a Camaro, both can be had around the same price, both are 2+2, coupes, front, rear, etc etc. Both even take design cues from models that came far before them. The rear quarter window desing on the FRS/BRZ was taken from 2000GT (IIRC). To say they aren't similar enough to compare is just horse shit, and only an excuse to reason away why the BRZ doesn't stack up when it comes to real world testing. I get you have convinced yourself this is something you have to get, despite never taking one for a spin, but your ideas of it's epic track ability and it giving the Mustang a run for its money have been thoroughly debunked.

DUDE. Like I've said before, the current gen Mustang with either motor is a great performance bargain and can be driven around a track very fast!

It's a bigger can than I want, it's not styling I'm that into, and I prefer the ideas behind the more balance minded BRZ. Plus I don't feel like being about a second off a lap is all the devastating considering the Mustang has 1/3 more HP and double the torque.

I've been arguing based on what I WANT, not what actaully is. Personal preference plays a HUGE roll in car purchase. Even though you think the Mustang is the BEST choice for what even I want to do, you can't say the BRZ is a silly choice for what I wan to do. Personally I feel like the way it is in stock form it will take to mods really well and be a fucking blast to drive on course all the time!

In SCCA this won't even be classed with Mustang anyway, street tire or stock classes.

Just for you I'll go test drive a V6 Mustang before I buy my BRZ.

[Lucidity]

Originally Posted by BlaineWasHere

DUDE. Like I've said before, the current gen Mustang with either motor is a great performance bargain and can be driven around a track very fast!

It's a bigger can than I want, it's not styling I'm that into, and I prefer the ideas behind the more balance minded BRZ. Plus I don't feel like being about a second off a lap is all the devastating considering the Mustang has 1/3 more HP and double the torque.

I've been arguing based on what I WANT, not what actaully is. Personal preference plays a HUGE roll in car purchase. Even though you think the Mustang is the BEST choice for what even I want to do, you can't say the BRZ is a silly choice for what I wan to do. Personally I feel like the way it is in stock form it will take to mods really well and be a fucking blast to drive on course all the time!

In SCCA this won't even be classed with Mustang anyway, street tire or stock classes.

Just for you I'll go test drive a V6 Mustang before I buy my BRZ.

Before you had dismissed the Mustang as being at a level not equal to the BRZ/FR-S... All I wanted to do is point out that's totally not the case, plus yeah considering the cost I think another 50hp is due in these modern times. Even more so when the head Scion rep talked about a price increase for the next MY. Styling is a big deal, personally I like the Mustang better with the new sequential LEDs at the rear and the new front end with HIDs standard, but they are both good looking cars. The Mustang is large, but after driving a 2012 GT, I can tell you that you really don't feel it in the way it handles, but too me the cockpit is a bit too roomy. I like more of a glove fit like the FR-S/BRZ, although the seating/steering adjustments just didn't seem to hit right for me personally, if you're shorter than 6 feet, you should be fine though. The next gen Mustang is really going to be hard to touch though, unless it comes in at a much higher base price.

I agree with you that this car being a success would be good, it will show other companies that despite the huge markets for both Camaros and Mustangs, there's still plenty of room for other inexpensive RWD cars, and hopefully that will mean a new 240sx.

[BlaineWasHere]

The next gen Mustang is going to be world car, meaning it'll get smaller, which IMO is a good thing. It's also going to have THREE motors: turbo 4, V6, and V8.

The most important thing is this can be the revival of the true sports car. The BRZ (and its buzz) has many manufactures ready to jump back in the segment. Mazda yelling "rotary is not dead," and hinting at a new RX-7. Nissan hasn't said they're not working on a smaller Z car (250Z?)(Nissan UK boss pretty much confirmed they've started R&D).

All of this is awesome for people who want cheap (relatively), efficient, cool, and fun to drive RWD coupes. I want to be a part of the sports car revolution!

[PRND[S]]

Rotary engines will be a tough sell for Mazda because of their poor fuel economy.

[Lucidity]

Originally Posted by PRND[S]

Rotary engines will be a tough sell for Mazda because of their poor fuel economy.

This.

It's not just about it being a world car, they want their fleet to lose weight to aid in fuel efficiency and performance. CAFE is fleet based, so if they bring up the average on the cars, they can continue to produce trucks without a huge worry about having to dramatically improve the mpg of the truck itself.

Nissan has been talking about a "250sx" for a while. The Z team already has a car in production.

Ultimately a business makes the call if they think they can make money, the segment is still shrinking, even if Mustang sales hit around 80k this year, that's still half of what they were doing in the 90s... which is crazy to think, I don't even think they even have anywhere near that capacity to produce now.

[BurntGauge]

Originally Posted by BlaineWasHere

Nissan hasn't said they're not working on a smaller Z car (250Z?)(Nissan UK boss pretty much confirmed they've started R&D).

More like 240SX (or 250SX)!

I agree...I'd love to see more RWD light, handling cars. Power would be nice too.

[JoeyGTI]

Subaru BRZ vs Mazda MX-5 Miata vs Hyundai Genesis Coupe


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ronU...&feature=g-u-u

[JoeyGTI]

because race car