GOLFMK8
GOLFMK7
GOLFMK6
GOLFMKV

BRAKE FLUIDS

the bruce

Go Kart Champion
Location
land
Car(s)
Golf GTI Mk.V 2008
:paddle::paddle::paddle:


Try Ate Blue next year and if it's worse - you've wasted 15 $. :wink:

Are there really any significient differences in compressibility? :iono:
 

junker

You get an 'F'!
Location
Berkeley
Car(s)
MkV GTI FSI
Not compressibility, but possibly with viscosity since they use a proprietary, distillation purified fluid. It does feel great, but how much of that is due to the quality of the bleed. :iono: I used a Motive on the previous 2-3 bleeds with my old set-up and never gained great pedal feel. And also there is the effect of the TyrolSport bushings. Highly recommended! :thumbsup:. Will bleed with Ate next time just to find out! Now I'm curious... :23:
 
Last edited:

the bruce

Go Kart Champion
Location
land
Car(s)
Golf GTI Mk.V 2008
I also wonder why so few Americans run Performance Friction pads (e.g. PFC05/06/08). :iono:

In Europe they're highly regarded (like Endless). :thumbsup: Guess in the US they should be cheaper.
 

Wild Hare

.: MR. BIG STUFF :.
Location
Nortvest
Car(s)
2015 Golf R (TUNED)

junker

You get an 'F'!
Location
Berkeley
Car(s)
MkV GTI FSI
I updated the main thread but my current set-up was enough to start to lock-up my front 235/40 18 Michelin SuperSports at ~75 mph on the freeway.

Good pads can produce pretty high friction levels with our stock calipers. So my brakes did their purpose and saved my ass one more time...
 
Last edited:

the bruce

Go Kart Champion
Location
land
Car(s)
Golf GTI Mk.V 2008
Make.......DOT Rating.....dry boiling point / wet boiling point


Amsoil DOT 4 - DOT 4 - 580°F (304°C) / 410°F (210°C)

AP Racing 551 - DOT 3 - 527°F (275°C) / 302ºF (145ºC)

AP Racing 600 - DOT 3 - 590°F (310°C) / 410°F (210°C)

AP PRF Racing - DOT 4 - 608°F (320ºC) / 311°F (155ºC)

Ate SL6 - DOT4 + ISO6 - 509°F (265°C) / 347°F (175°C)

ATE Super Blue - DOT 4 - 536ºF (280ºC) / 396ºF (194ºC)

ATE Super 200 - DOT 4 - 536ºF (280ºC) / 382ºF (194ºC)

BMW OEM - DOT 4 - 446*F (224°) / 311*F (156°)

Bosch - DOT 3 - 491ºF (255ºC) / 288ºF (142ºC)

Bosch - DOT 4 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 329ºF (165ºC)

Bosch - DOT 4+ - 536ºF (280ºC) / 356ºF (180ºC)

Brembo LCF 600+ - DOT 4 - 601ºF (316ºC) / 399ºF (204ºC)

Brembo EVO 500+ - DOT 4 - 520ºF (271ºC) / 336ºF (169ºC)

Castrol GT LMA - DOT 4 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 311ºF (155ºC)

Castrol SRF - DOT 4 - 590ºF (310ºC) / 518ºF (270ºC)

Endless RF-650 - DOT4? - 612°F (323˚C) / 425°F (218˚C)

GS610 - DOT 4 - 610°F (321°C) / 421°F (216°C)

Gunk HD - DOT 4 - 510ºF (266ºC) / 311ºF (155ºC)

Motul DOT 5.1 - DOT 5.1 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 365ºF (185ºC)

Motul RBF 600 - DOT 4 - 594ºF (312ºC) / 421ºF (216ºC)

Motul RBF 660 - DOT 4 - 617ºF (325ºC) / 400ºF (204ºC)

Neo Super DOT16 - DOT 4 - 610°F (322°C) / 421°F (216°C)

Pentosin Super - DOT 4 - 500°F (260°C) / 338°F (170°C)

Pentosin RBF - DOT 5.1 - 572°F (300°C) / 392ºF (200°C)

Project µ G-four 335 - DOT 4 - 634°F (335°C) / 429°F (221°C)

Prospeed RS683 - DOT 4 - 683°F (360°C) / 439°F (224°C)

ValvolineProSyn - DOT 3/4 - 527ºF (275ºC) / 347ºF (175ºC)

Wilwood Hi-Temp 570 - DOT 3 - 570ºF (299ºC) / 284ºF (140ºC)

Wilwood EXP600 Plus - DOT 4 - 633ºF (330ºC) / 417ºF (213ºC)


VW uses a J 1704 FMVS16 Audi/VW 501.14 spec. Looks like Ate SL6 is similar.

http://www.ate.de/generator/www/com...msfluessigkeiten/download/bf_flyer_pdf_de.pdf

Ate SL6 has a low temp vicosity of 700 mm²/s (Super 200 and Super Blue Racing max 1400 mm²/s).


Parameter ...... DOT 3 .... DOT 4 ..... DOT 5.1
dry boiling point [°C] ... 205 ... 230 ... 260
wet boiling point [°C] ... 140 ... 155 ... 180
viscosity at 100 °C [mm²/s] ... 1,5 ... 1,5 ... 1,5
viscosity at -40 °C [mm²/s] ..... 1500 ... 1800 ... 900


added:

Project µ G-four 335 - DOT 4 - 634°F (335°C) / 429°F (221°C)

 
Last edited:

the bruce

Go Kart Champion
Location
land
Car(s)
Golf GTI Mk.V 2008
Make.......DOT Rating.....dry boiling point / wet boiling point


Amsoil DOT 4 - DOT 4 - 580°F (304°C) / 410°F (210°C)

AP Racing 551 - DOT 3 - 527°F (275°C) / 302ºF (145ºC)

AP Racing 600 - DOT 3 - 590°F (310°C) / 410°F (210°C)

AP PRF Racing - DOT 4 - 608°F (320ºC) / 311°F (155ºC)

Ate SL6 - DOT4 + ISO6 - 509°F (265°C) / 347°F (175°C)

Ate Super Blue - DOT 4 - 536ºF (280ºC) / 390ºF (194ºC)

Ate Super 200 - DOT 4 - 536ºF (280ºC) / 390ºF (194ºC)

BMW OEM - DOT 4 - 446*F (224°) / 311*F (156°)

Bosch - DOT 3 - 491ºF (255ºC) / 288ºF (142ºC)

Bosch - DOT 4 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 329ºF (165ºC)

Bosch - DOT 4+ - 536ºF (280ºC) / 356ºF (180ºC)

Brembo LCF 600+ - DOT 4 - 601ºF (316ºC) / 399ºF (204ºC)

Brembo EVO 500+ - DOT 4 - 520ºF (271ºC) / 336ºF (169ºC)

Castrol GT LMA - DOT 4 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 311ºF (155ºC)

Castrol SRF - DOT 4 - 590ºF (310ºC) / 518ºF (270ºC)

Endless RF-650 - DOT4 - 612°F (323°C) / 425°F (218°C)

GS610 - DOT 4 - 610°F (321°C) / 421°F (216°C)

Gunk HD - DOT 4 - 510ºF (266ºC) / 311ºF (155ºC)

Motul DOT 5.1 - DOT 5.1 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 365ºF (185ºC)

Motul RBF 600 - DOT 4 - 594ºF (312ºC) / 421ºF (216ºC)

Motul RBF 660 - DOT 4 - 617ºF (325ºC) / 400ºF (204ºC)

Neo Super DOT16 - DOT 4 - 610°F (322°C) / 421°F (216°C)

Pentosin Super - DOT 4 - 500°F (260°C) / 338°F (170°C)

Pentosin RBF - DOT 4 - 572°F (300°C) / 392ºF (200°C)

Performance Friction RH665 - DOT 4 - 617°F (325°C) / 395°F (195°C)

Project µ G-four 335 - DOT 4 - 634°F (335°C) / 429°F (221°C)

Prospeed RS683 - DOT 4 - 683°F (360°C) / 439°F (224°C)

TAR•OX Roadrace - DOT 4 - 583°F (314°C) / 401°F (205°C)

ValvolineProSyn - DOT 3/4 - 527ºF (275ºC) / 347ºF (175ºC)

Wilwood Hi-Temp 570 - DOT 3 - 570ºF (299ºC) / 284ºF (140ºC)

Wilwood EXP600 Plus - DOT 4 - 633ºF (330ºC) / 417ºF (213ºC)
 

the bruce

Go Kart Champion
Location
land
Car(s)
Golf GTI Mk.V 2008
Some more:


Make.......DOT Rating.....dry boiling point / wet boiling point


AP Racing 551 - DOT3 - 527°F (275°C) / 302ºF (145ºC)

AP Racing 600 - DOT3 - 590°F (310°C) / 410°F (210°C)

AP PRF Racing - DOT4 - 608°F (320ºC) / 311°F (155ºC)

Ate SL6 - DOT4 + ISO6 - 509°F (265°C) / 347°F (175°C)

Ate Super Blue - DOT4 - 536ºF (280ºC) / 390ºF (194ºC)

Ate Super 200 - DOT4 - 536ºF (280ºC) / 390ºF (194ºC)

BMW OEM - DOT4 - 446*F (224°) / 311*F (156°)

Bosch - DOT3 - 491ºF (255ºC) / 288ºF (142ºC)

Bosch - DOT4 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 329ºF (165ºC)

Bosch - DOT4+ - 536ºF (280ºC) / 356ºF (180ºC)

Brembo LCF 600+ - DOT4 - 601ºF (316ºC) / 399ºF (204ºC)

Brembo EVO 500+ - DOT4 - 520ºF (271ºC) / 336ºF (169ºC)

Castrol GT LMA - DOT4 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 311ºF (155ºC)

Castrol SRF - DOT4 - 590ºF (310ºC) / 518ºF (270ºC)

Endless RF-650 - DOT4 - 612°F (323°C) / 425°F (218°C)

Endless S-Four High-Performance - DOT4 - 567°F (297ºC) / 366ºF (187ºC)

Ferodo Racing DOT5.1 - DOT5.1 - 500°F (260°C) / XXXX (XXXX)

Ferodo Racing Formula - DOT4 - 572°F (300°C) / XXXX (XXXX)

Ferodo Racing Super Formula - DOT4 - 625°F (330°C) / XXXX (XXXX)

GS610 - DOT4 - 610°F (321°C) / 421°F (216°C)

Gunk HD - DOT4 - 510ºF (266ºC) / 311ºF (155ºC)

Millers Racing 300 Plus - DOT4 - 590°F (310°C) / XXXX (XXXX)

Motul DOT 5.1 - DOT5.1 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 365ºF (185ºC)

Motul RBF 600 - DOT4 - 594ºF (312ºC) / 421ºF (216ºC)

Motul RBF 660 - DOT4 - 617ºF (325ºC) / 400ºF (204ºC)

Neo Super DOT16 - DOT4 - 610°F (322°C) / 421°F (216°C)

Pentosin Super - DOT4 - 500°F (260°C) / 338°F (170°C)

Pentosin RBF - DOT4 - 572°F (300°C) / 392ºF (200°C)

Performance Friction RH665 - DOT4 - 617°F (325°C) / 395°F (195°C)

Project µ G-four 335 - DOT4 - 634°F (335°C) / 429°F (221°C)

Prospeed RS683 - DOT4 - 683°F (360°C) / 439°F (224°C)

Tarox Roadrace - DOT4 - 583°F (314°C) / 401°F (205°C)

ValvolineProSyn - DOT3/4 - 527ºF (275ºC) / 347ºF (175ºC)

Wilwood Hi-Temp 570 - DOT3 - 570ºF (299ºC) / 284ºF (140ºC)

Wilwood EXP600 Plus - DOT4 - 633ºF (330ºC) / 417ºF (213ºC)
 

the bruce

Go Kart Champion
Location
land
Car(s)
Golf GTI Mk.V 2008
brake fluid data

.


make..........DOT Rating......dry boiling point / wet boiling point


(higher wet boiling points recommended)


AP Racing 551 - DOT3 - 527° F (275° C) / 302º F (145º C)

AP Racing 600 - DOT3 - 590° F (310° C) / 410° F (210° C)

AP PRF Racing - DOT4 - 608° F (320º C) / 311° F (155º C)

Ate SL6 - DOT4 + ISO6 - 509° F (265° C) / 347° F (175° C)

Ate Super Blue - DOT4 - 536º F (280º C) / 390º F (194º C)

Ate Super 200 - DOT4 - 536º F (280º C) / 390º F (194º C)

BMW OEM - DOT4 - 446° F (224° C) / 311° F (156° C)

Bosch - DOT3 - 491º F (255º C) / 288º F (142º C)

Bosch - DOT4 - 509º F (265º C) / 329º F (165º C)

Bosch - DOT4+ - 536º F (280º C) / 356º F (180º C)

Brembo LCF 600+ - DOT4 - 601º F (316º C) / 399º F (204º C)

Brembo EVO 500+ - DOT4 - 520º F (271º C) / 336º F (169º C)

Castrol GT LMA - DOT4 - 509º F (265º C) / 311º F (155º C)

Castrol SRF - DOT4 - 590º F (310º C) / 518º F (270º C)

EBC BF 307+ - DOT4 - 589° F (307° C) / 386° F (196° C)

Endless RF-650 - DOT4 - 612° F (323° C) / 425° F (218° C)

Endless S-Four High-Perf. - DOT4 - 567° F (297º C) / 366º F (187º C)

Ferodo Racing DOT5.1 - DOT5.1 - 500° F (260° C) / XXXX (XXXX)

Ferodo Racing Formula - DOT4 - 572° F (300° C) / XXXX (XXXX)

Ferodo Racing Super Formula - DOT4 - 625° F (330° C) / XXXX (XXXX)

GS610 - DOT4 - 610° F (321° C) / 421° F (216° C)

Gunk HD - DOT4 - 510º F (266º C) / 311º F (155º C)

Millers Racing 300 Plus - DOT4 - 590° F (310° C) / XXXX (XXXX)

Motul DOT 5.1 - DOT5.1 - 509º F (265º C) / 365º F (185º C)

Motul RBF 600 - DOT4 - 594º F (312º C) / 402º F (205º C)

Motul RBF 660 - DOT4 - 617º F (325º C) / 400º F (204º C)

Neo Super DOT16 - DOT4 - 610° F (322° C) / 421° F (216° C)

Pentosin Super - DOT4 - 500° F (260° C) / 338° F (170° C)

Pentosin RBF - DOT4 - 572° F (300° C) / 392º F (200° C)

Performance Friction RH665 - DOT4 - 617° F (325° C) / 395° F (195° C)

Project µ G-four 335 - DOT4 - 634° F (335° C) / 429° F (221° C)

Prospeed RS683 - DOT4 - 683° F (360° C) / 439° F (224° C)

Tarox Roadrace - DOT4 - 583° F (314° C) / 402° F (205° C)

TRW Grand Prix 600 - DOT5.1 - 594º F (312º C) / 400º F (204º C)

ValvolineProSyn - DOT3/4 - 527º F (275º C) / 347º F (175º C)

Wilwood Hi-Temp 570 - DOT3 - 570º F (299º C) / 284º F (140º C)

Wilwood EXP600 Plus - DOT4 - 633º F (330º C) / 417º F (213º C)
 

the bruce

Go Kart Champion
Location
land
Car(s)
Golf GTI Mk.V 2008
.


make..........DOT Rating......dry boiling point / wet boiling point


(higher wet boiling points recommended)



Amsoil DOT 4 - DOT 4 - 580°F (304°C) / 410°F (210°C)

AP Racing 551 - DOT3 - 527° F (275° C) / 302º F (145º C)

AP Racing 600 - DOT3 - 590° F (310° C) / 410° F (210° C)

AP PRF Racing - DOT4 - 608° F (320º C) / 311° F (155º C)

Ate SL6 - DOT4 + ISO6 - 509° F (265° C) / 347° F (175° C)

Ate Super Blue - DOT4 - 536º F (280º C) / 390º F (194º C)

Ate Super 200 - DOT4 - 536º F (280º C) / 390º F (194º C)

BMW OEM - DOT4 - 446° F (224° C) / 311° F (156° C)

Bosch - DOT3 - 491º F (255º C) / 288º F (142º C)

Bosch - DOT4 - 509º F (265º C) / 329º F (165º C)

Bosch - DOT4+ - 536º F (280º C) / 356º F (180º C)

Brembo LCF 600+ - DOT4 - 601º F (316º C) / 399º F (204º C)

Brembo EVO 500+ - DOT4 - 520º F (271º C) / 336º F (169º C)

Castrol GT LMA - DOT4 - 509º F (265º C) / 311º F (155º C)

Castrol SRF - DOT4 - 590º F (310º C) / 518º F (270º C)

EBC BF 307+ - DOT4 - 589° F (307° C) / 386° F (196° C)

Endless RF-650 - DOT4 - 612° F (323° C) / 425° F (218° C)

Endless S-Four High-Perf. - DOT4 - 567° F (297º C) / 366º F (187º C)

Ferodo Racing DOT5.1 - DOT5.1 - 500° F (260° C) / XXXX (XXXX)

Ferodo Racing Formula - DOT4 - 572° F (300° C) / XXXX (XXXX)

Ferodo Racing Super Formula - DOT4 - 625° F (330° C) / XXXX (XXXX)

GS610 - DOT4 - 610° F (321° C) / 421° F (216° C)

Gunk HD - DOT4 - 510º F (266º C) / 311º F (155º C)

Millers Racing 300 Plus - DOT4 - 590° F (310° C) / XXXX (XXXX)

Motul DOT 5.1 - DOT5.1 - 509º F (265º C) / 365º F (185º C)

Motul RBF 600 - DOT4 - 594º F (312º C) / 402º F (205º C)

Motul RBF 660 - DOT4 - 617º F (325º C) / 400º F (204º C)

Neo Super DOT16 - DOT4 - 610° F (322° C) / 421° F (216° C)

Pentosin Super - DOT4 - 500° F (260° C) / 338° F (170° C)

Pentosin RBF - DOT4 - 572° F (300° C) / 392º F (200° C)

Performance Friction RH665 - DOT4 - 617° F (325° C) / 395° F (195° C)

Project µ G-four 335 - DOT4 - 634° F (335° C) / 429° F (221° C)

Prospeed RS683 - DOT4 - 683° F (360° C) / 439° F (224° C)

Ravenol DOT4 - 500° F (260° C) / 329º F (165° C)

Ravenol DOT5.1 - 500° F (260° C) / 356º F (180° C)

Tarox Roadrace - DOT4 - 583° F (314° C) / 402° F (205° C)

TRW Grand Prix 600 - DOT5.1 - 594º F (312º C) / 400º F (204º C)

ValvolineProSyn - DOT3/4 - 527º F (275º C) / 347º F (175º C)

Wilwood Hi-Temp 570 - DOT3 - 570º F (299º C) / 284º F (140º C)

Wilwood EXP600 Plus - DOT4 - 633º F (330º C) / 417º F (213º C)
 

JRutter

old man
Location
Bellingham, WA
Have you guys heard anything about Torque RT700?
Dry 683 °F (361.8° C)
Wet 439° F (226.1° C)

http://www.torquebrakefluid.com/rt700-specifications.html

Was recommended to me by a motorsport shop who used to sell Endless.

[edit] Got some and on the street it does have good pedal feel. My brakes didn't feel this good when they were freshly installed with Motul 5.1
 
Last edited:

Autobahn

Autocross Champion
Location
Huntington Beach, CA
Car(s)
'18 Golf R
Excellent info, I've looked at this thread a few times but always thought my Ate Super Blue was enough.

I just got my calipers rebuilt and rings inspected so I have the choice to try a new fluid since most of the fluid drained out and reservoir is dry. I've never had any issues with Ate SB although I noticed something a few events ago. I was switching out to my track pads before my first heat and introduced some air in the system since my reservoir got overfilled retracting the pistons. I like to do the traditional pump/hold method, it always works really well for me.

So I was able to get a really nice bleed, the pedal was very high in engagement. The first session went really well, I eased into the heat slowly and my last lap I beat my quickest time (2:01 Auto Club Speedway). Then second heat the brakes felt great but the engagement point had lowered a little bit, not enough to cause alarm, but enough to notice.

Is this the fluid getting compressed a bit? Would trying endless or srf fluid help with this? I was just going to get Ate Typ 200 since it's cost effective but I haven't been doing any mods, just maintenance so I have a little extra to spend.
 

miamirice

Ready to race!
Location
Miami
Excellent info, I've looked at this thread a few times but always thought my Ate Super Blue was enough.

I just got my calipers rebuilt and rings inspected so I have the choice to try a new fluid since most of the fluid drained out and reservoir is dry. I've never had any issues with Ate SB although I noticed something a few events ago. I was switching out to my track pads before my first heat and introduced some air in the system since my reservoir got overfilled retracting the pistons. I like to do the traditional pump/hold method, it always works really well for me.

So I was able to get a really nice bleed, the pedal was very high in engagement. The first session went really well, I eased into the heat slowly and my last lap I beat my quickest time (2:01 Auto Club Speedway). Then second heat the brakes felt great but the engagement point had lowered a little bit, not enough to cause alarm, but enough to notice.

Is this the fluid getting compressed a bit? Would trying endless or srf fluid help with this? I was just going to get Ate Typ 200 since it's cost effective but I haven't been doing any mods, just maintenance so I have a little extra to spend.

I would agree with this. On race weekends we run a handful of sprints and enduros. The enduros can be 3-24 hour races. The fluid so long as it's dot 4 not a huge concern ( for what it's worth I see mostly Motul and some ATE). A bigger concern if you are really running brakes hard on FWD is hub failure and axle failure. My last 3 hour the right CV literally blew up. Running FWD on banking with R compounds is a bitch on these parts. So I went away from OEM to some meaty rebuilt axles with vented boots and better grease. A hub failure is a big deal compared to a pedal that starts to go soft - Keep axle/hub regular replacement in mind if you are pushing dot 4 fluids hard enough to get a deep pedal.
 
Top